Starting Over Talk

Gee, I didn't think I had to provide a _link_ within the same site?

I thought there was a clear one in Antonia's forum....

but it was dubbed daughter/father relationships or something such... I think Mazzy started it.

http://startingovertalk.com/index.php?option=com_joomlaboard&Itemid=99&func=view&id=59512&catid=106

Since alot of people don't even venture into the spoilers... I thought it would be better to put the discussion topic out into the main forum area.

There may have been another thread too... But can't find it at the moment.

Hi everybody. I am a counselor by profession so I think this is why I see that Antonia does have father issues that she would be well served to address. Actually meeting with him and having a relationship is not the same as resolving the negative impact that relationship has had on her thus far. Her best memory of her father is related to opening a gift box that was full of money and over time money was the foundation of their relationship. She has been clear about that aspect of her story. When I am working with a client who is so strongly resistant to an issue I ask if the issue is not a problem then what is the problem with discussing it. I do wonder about her level of motivation to get real and do the work though.

Actually meeting with him and having a relationship is not the same as resolving the negative impact that relationship has had on her thus far.

I agree with this. The problem though, is that every time someone on SO wants to talk to Antonia about her father, it is with the specific agenda of her meeting with him and possibly having that relationship. It is SO that equates resolving negative impacts (if any), and "re-connecting" in some way with her father. Witness the Jennifer fiasco today.

Had they approached the issue from a different perspective, Antonia might well have reacted differently.

I also believe that resistance on an issue can mean a lot of things. If Iyanla kept telling Antonia, let's talk about the fact that you have two heads, over and over again, and Antonia denied it and denied it and eventually became downright cranky about Iyanla's preoccupation with such a non-issue, no one would blame Antonia. The "father" issue may well be something she has addressed in her OWN way, in that the man really is a ghost in her life, has no personal meaning to her and causes her more grief in than out of her life. Resistance can also mean, hey Iyanla, maybe it is YOU who have a lingering issue with an absent parent - and you are projecting that onto me.

Whatever the significance, if any, of the father in Antonia's current life, SO has botched the chance to address it in a way that does not legitimately offend Antonia.

JumboGuy wrote:
Hi everybody. I am a counselor by profession so I think this is why I see that Antonia does have father issues that she would be well served to address. Actually meeting with him and having a relationship is not the same as resolving the negative impact that relationship has had on her thus far. Her best memory of her father is related to opening a gift box that was full of money and over time money was the foundation of their relationship. She has been clear about that aspect of her story. When I am working with a client who is so strongly resistant to an issue I ask if the issue is not a problem then what is the problem with discussing it. I do wonder about her level of motivation to get real and do the work though.

That's the way I see it too..what's the problem with discussing it?
But, I'm not going to get too excited about it...the"fat lady has
not sung yet!" There could be a lot of reasons...hasn't made the
connection in her own head yet, might be ashamed of having a
father in prison, might have had her opinion "shaped." She'll
decide for herself, either way, but I do agree about the resistance.
I'm like Iyanla, in that I thought it verrrry interesting that her
tooth broke at that particular moment! Things like that have a
way of happening when you are all tensed up!

valtina wrote:
Actually meeting with him and having a relationship is not the same as resolving the negative impact that relationship has had on her thus far.

I agree with this. The problem though, is that every time someone on SO wants to talk to Antonia about her father, it is with the specific agenda of her meeting with him and possibly having that relationship. It is SO that equates resolving negative impacts (if any), and "re-connecting" in some way with her father. Witness the Jennifer fiasco today.

Had they approached the issue from a different perspective, Antonia might well have reacted differently.

I also believe that resistance on an issue can mean a lot of things. If Iyanla kept telling Antonia, let's talk about the fact that you have two heads, over and over again, and Antonia denied it and denied it and eventually became downright cranky about Iyanla's preoccupation with such a non-issue, no one would blame Antonia. The "father" issue may well be something she has addressed in her OWN way, in that the man really is a ghost in her life, has no personal meaning to her and causes her more grief in than out of her life. Resistance can also mean, hey Iyanla, maybe it is YOU who have a lingering issue with an absent parent - and you are projecting that onto me.

Whatever the significance, if any, of the father in Antonia's current life, SO has botched the chance to address it in a way that does not legitimately offend Antonia.

This is how I feel too. I can see why Antonia is so annoyed. I don't remember them trying to talk about her dad just to talk about him, because it always turns into somebody saying Antonia needs to see him. If Iyanla asked Antonia to just talk instead of telling her make a list of everything you missed when you were small because your dad was gone, that would have been a conversation not a judgement and less pressure. Iyanla is all about Antonia needing something from her dad and that's an assumption and it gets to Antonia. Then Jennifer talked about Antonia's dad missing her like she was supposed to start feeling bad about that. Maybe that's just their life not Antonia's. I'm glad she knows her own mind and tells people when they are wrong about her. To me it isn't resisting when the message is wrong.

doxygirl wrote:

This is how I feel too. I can see why Antonia is so annoyed....
All you see is editing, hon.
Toni is pretty spoiled-- used to having it her way and making it her way. I'm glad IV's pushing on her hard, getting her to move out of her comfort zone.
Note to Toni:
Get a roommate, Toni-- save your money, and then go visit your dad in jail. (You think you're embarrassed-- Whatever, he probably said he didn't do it.) You better speak your piece fast 'cause we're running out of patience.
Hope that helps, IV.